Public sentiment towards India's acquisition of the S-400 missile systems from Russia is broadly positive, with widespread recognition of its strategic importance in enhancing India's defense capabilities and maintaining a balance among global powers. Many express pride and support for India's independent defense strategy, emphasizing the need for technological self-reliance and diversified international alliances. There is a strong appreciation for India's geopolitical strategy, though some concerns are noted about costs and the necessity of strengthening domestic defense production.

India

Russia

United States

Translation : Russia wants to sell, india has neither shown interest nor had any conversations.

S-500 is for ballistic and hypersonic missile defense only. It is meant to work with S-400, not replace it..

Not the same capability, but India has developed (but not deployed ) phase 1 of an Indigenous ballistic missile defense and is working on phase 2

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E: phase 1 ~= ballistic missiles from pak to delhi  Phase 2~= some chinese ballistic missiles.

barath_s

Man I *really* wouldn't want to trust their caveman radar tech with ballistic missile defense...

KovaaksGigaChadGamer

Oh, are countries still interested in Russian weaponry after their Ukraine infomercial?  I joke but wow that a spectacular advertisement of their own military's incompetence and their own dysfunction.  But still, considering the value of the rouble you could probably get Russian SAMs in trade for like carts of rice, or maybe throw in some tasty hummus.

GrandOldPharisees

Why is this ok. The Russians and Chinese get triggered whenever the us tries to put thaad anywhere or sell it to anyone but this is fine for them them to do? 

Plus neither system was able to stop 50 year old Ukrainian tochkas so that leaves doubts as to their effectiveness.

yeeeter1

NATO members with S-300 and S-400 systems:

* Greece
* Slovakia
* Bulgaria
* Turkey

KingKohishi

uurtskn

01Cloud01

Cool map, though as it’s a Russian system, almost entirely predictable... Slovakia did shock me a little and Greece big time, tough.

[deleted]

I would like to highlight common notion among Pakistani defence "analysts" that India is starting an Arms race in the region, while clearly having no idea what actually is the Arms race.

India has lower defence budget than America dictated minimum viable for NATO countries i.e. 2% GDP. While India has around 1.8% of GDP as defence budget. 

The defence spending is solely for maintaining balance against the Chinese threats. While China has technologies like FOBS, HGV, MIRV, etc, its crucial to maintain power balance.

whateveruthink334

Why does the author sound so.... aggressive? Throughout the article the author claims that this acquisition of AD will destabilize the region but conveniently ignores that all aggressive actions have been initiated by Pakistan? Second, nowhere have I seen that Indian defense officials claim the S-400 is invincible or has no vulnerability. Everyone knows no system has a 100 percent success rate and the author seems to be trying to make a mountain out of a molehill for some reason. Finally just nitpicking but the author didn't actually give any solution as to how Pakistan will counter the fact that the S-400 has the range to shoot down jets in Islamabad itself except for stating that India hasn't taken into account "Pakistan's tactics" whatever that may be

Edit: Looks like the author is Pakistani herself. No wonder the aggressive stance taken towards this particular acquisition lol

Regular-Habit-1206

I heard about this in the news but did not know much more than that, so I found this article that gives some background information. It is amazing that this one system can have such major implications for India with the US, China, Pakistan, and Russia, all at the same time. Apparently it has become a major subject in Indian mass media with lots of misinfo flying around. 

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&gt; * India’s quest for attaining superior military technology has materialized in New Delhi’s purchase of the S-400 air defense system from Russia. 

&gt; * The S-400 has drawn the interest of US allies and adversaries alike.

&gt; * The system is integrated with autonomous detection and targeting systems, launchers, multifunctional radars, and command and control and is equipped with the capability to fire multiple missiles to create a layered defense. Furthermore, it can track 80 targets simultaneously and can be made operational within five minutes.

&gt; * India aims to curtail Pakistan’s capabilities by denying it ingress to the Indian territory in case of an aerial engagement, for which India is augmenting both defensive and offensive capabilities.

&gt; * The former Indian Chief of Air Staff, Air Chief Marshal (ret.) B. S. Dhanoa, in an interview stated that “the purpose of the S-400 missile system and Rafale is to hit Pakistani aircraft inside Pakistani air space and not when they come inside Indian territory.”16

&gt; * The S-400 will alter the minimum deterrence levels, provoking an arms race between the archrivals

&gt; * All these factors add up and compound the threat to the regional peace of South Asia, making it more unstable.

&gt; * India and Pakistan have not engaged in any productive dialogue following an aerial engagement in February 2019, and India’s unilateral action taken in Kashmir by the abrogation of Article 370 has further impaired the already strained relations between the two countries. With the delivery of the S-400 system in late 2021, Indian leadership likely will be even more reluctant to terminate the deadlock in the bilateral relations.

&gt; * Recently, Russian air defense systems have failed to perform optimally, particularly in Syria, Libya, and Armenia.

&gt; * In April 2020, the Syrian military raised concerns over the performance of S-300 air defense system when its radars failed to detect and target Israeli cruise missiles on various occasions.

&gt; * On 28 February, Syria lost three Pantsir-S1 and one Buk-1 air defense systems deployed in Idlib.42 These systems became a target of Turkish drones, which employed electronic warfare to evade the air defense systems. Ironically, the Pantsir-S1 is perceived as one of the most advanced air defense systems in the Russian inventory and is designed specifically for short-range air defense. However, footage showed that the radars of these systems were active before they were hit, which raises concerns over their effectiveness.43

&gt; * The S-400 has not been used by the Russians in Syria to counter Israeli strikes. This development implies that even the Russian operators are aware that, in the likely event that the incoming aerial vehicles are more than the handling capacity of their state-of-the-art air defense system, some of them will go unintercepted, which will raise questions over a system tagged as the world’s best air defense system.

&gt; * The recent Nagorno-Karabakh conflict in late 2020, is another example where the vulnerability of air defenses against drones has been exposed. 

&gt; * Azerbaijan used decoy aircraft in Armenian territory, which were shot at by the deployed air defense systems. This action exposed the locations of those air defense systems, which were then neutralized by drones. Russian air defense systems such as the 2K12 Kub, 9K35 Strela-10, 9K33 Osa, and 2K11 Krug could not intercept a number of drones, which either reached their intended targets or destroyed the air defense system itself. Azerbaijan has also claimed that it destroyed several batteries of the S-300 air defense systems45 and circulated footage in this regard. This is highly concerning, as it suggests that the S-400, which is the successor of S-300, could have similar vulnerabilities.

&gt; * In May 2020, the Libyan army was also successful in destroying nine Russian Pantsir-S1 air defense systems

&gt; * Moreover, air defense systems were more optimal for Cold War–type scenarios, in which the travel time was at least 30 minutes. As far as India and Pakistan are concerned, the proximity would leave very minimal reaction time. 

&gt; * The Indian regime is all set to obtain this technology, despite the fact that the purchase could invoke CAATSA sanctions. However, it is likely that India will be able to get a waiver or some relaxation from the United States, an important strategic partner.

&gt; * The introduction of the S-400 will have significant consequences for regional stability, creating a negative impact on the arms race and vertical proliferation in South Asia. 

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About the Author:

Shaza Arif is a Researcher at the Centre for Aerospace &amp; Security Studies (CASS). She has secured a gold medal in B.Sc. (Hons) Defence and Diplomatic Studies from Fatima Jinnah Women University, Rawalpindi. Her areas of interest include emerging technologies. She has contributed book chapters, research papers, and opinion articles in national and international platforms. She represented Pakistan at an international workshop titled “Commonwealth Future: Re-imaging Peace” at Durban University of Technology, South Africa, in March 2020.

MarshalWillKane

The article is old(Aug 2021) and was already out of date when published. 

&gt; The National Advanced Surface-to-Air Missile System II (NASAMS-II) represents the innermost layer, aimed at protecting the cities.14

IAF had already declined NASAMS in favour of developing an indigenous system back in 2020. Indigenous VL-SRSAM systems had already been tested by the time this article was released.

Indira-Gandhi

Correct me if I am wrong but the west doesn't quite have anything like the S-300/S-400? Western military doctrine is overwhelming air superiority vs an air defense umbrella that would essentially keep the air contested at all times. I can see why India and Turkey wanted the S-400 instead of whatever the west offered. And the Patriot hasn't exactly had a good showing in Saudi Arabia either.

Echelon64

Can we really talk about India's regional hegemony when it borders China?

Also, as the author rightly points out, Pakistan already has missile systems expected to be largely effective against the S-400. We still don't know how good the S-400 is (Western estimates range from paper tiger to good) but the system can only provide additional capability in one specific air-defence niche, not across the AD spectrum.

Glideer

You seem quite misinformed. If anything this war has underlined how effective GBAD systems are. Ukraine's vast prewar stockpile of S300 and Buk systems have prevented Russia from attaining air superiority (let alone air supremacy), despite Russia's air force on paper having the strength to do so many times over.

The lessons you should be taking from Ukraine are not that GBAD doesn't work - it works quite effectively. And clearly SEAD/DEAD missions are nowhere near as easy as the US makes them look. Because on paper Russia should have had air superiority within the first week of this war, a task they have utterly failed at. Instead, Ukraine continue to be able to fly both helicopters and fixed-wing aircraft, despite having a tiny air force relative to Russia's.

Now, all that being said, I think Turkey probably still made a mistake purchasing the S400, because the Russian arms export industry is dying and what production they have is focused almost entirely on the war (making future orders and service harder). And because the F-35 is a *much* more significant asset a GBAD platform which could easily be substituted for by another made in the West. We'll see how Turkey's domestic stealth fighter program ends up performing, but the F-35 is continuing to drop in cost and improve in capability, and is a proven stealth fighter that is actually being mass produced, exported, used and customized by dozens of countries. Which is something no other stealth fighter program is really doing, even the Chinese ones which are at least being mass produced.

Brendissimo

My understanding is that the US and other NATO countries don't want to sell their AD tech to Turkiey while they have russian techs in country to service russian equipment 

As far as the planes go, not letting them have F35's is partially a punishment for their lack of cooperation on NATO goals, buying enemy equipment, sometimes siding with russia, and whatever they get, Cyprus has to have the same

NATO and the US in particular want Turkiey to act like a NATO country instead of fence riding for individual gain like Erdogan has been doing

S300,400 saved Kyiv's bacon before they got western systems. They work well enough. Russia's main problem with AD is that they haven't got enough systems to protect such a vast territory plus occupied territories, Crimea and the Kerch bridge

Boxedin-nolife

Strange question given how effective Russian Tor, Buk, S300 systems in Ukrainian service have been in denying Russia air superiority.

Whyumad_brah

Turkey bought four S400 systems then promptly reverse engineered them to create their own system so it probably wasn’t a mistake, just a step to creating their own AD systems. Whether or not this distinction is enough for the US to let them back into the F-35 club remains to be seen. https://breakingdefense.com/2023/03/as-interest-in-russias-s-400-wanes-turkey-pushes-its-own-air-defense-systems/?amp=1)

What we need to ask actually is why did the system have been a failure? Is that because the system is not functioning as it should be? 

Or is it the way they used it in ukrain and the battlefield conditions?

That will answer your original question.

EfficiencyNo1396

Failure?

Is Someone flying unopposed  over Russian Skies on a daily basis.


Every success NATO had in penetrating Russian air defences with anything is result of long term planning and observing.

Thats wasteful use of expensive resources in order to achieve a successful  penetration every month or two, with often miniscule results.

On the other hand number of denied penetrations is enormous.

In other direction Russians are dropping missiles on enemy forces and infrastructural and logistic objects on a daily basis multiple times. Penetrating deep into enemy territory, occasionally even up to Polish border.

RandomAndCasual

First of all, it is necessary to summarize 3 items. Turkish air forces knew they had extreme air defense system vulnerabilities. That's why they wanted to buy an Ad system. Defense companies in Turkey knew that they would produce a new generation AD weapon system within 7-8 years, even if its range was not as superior as the S400, and they had already tested it. It does not matter whether there is technology transfer or not. The system developed by Turkey is different from the S400 anyway. The S400 uses Pesa radar. Turkish systems are Aesa. Third, the Turkish air force had doubts about the quality of the S400.

Turkey wanted to purchase Patriots before the 2010s, but did not receive a response. In the following years, he opened a tender for the air defense system. According to the tender conditions, Chinese-made systems won the tender. Later, Turkey canceled the tender because the USA said it would sell Patriot. When Türkiye wanted to buy Patriots again, it did not receive a positive response. Meanwhile, he also requested technology transfer from the USA.

 Later, while they had close relations with Russia, there was a coup attempt in Turkey on July 15, 2016. The process of Turkey seeing the USA as the main threat started from this date. Turkish navy and land forces have already seen the USA as the main threat for years, and after both the disapproval of the Patriot sale and the coup attempt, Erdoğan himself and the air force agreed to the S400 deal.

 Moreover, S400 is a bribe given to Russia for Turkey's operations in Syria. For Turkey, the S400 is a way of saying that I can buy weapons from wherever I want and that my position is now neutral. Even if Türkiye has a better system than the S400, it will not ship the S400 to any country except Azerbaijan.

 Turkey did not expect to be removed from the F35 program. Because according to their predictions, Turkey would not include the S400s in the joint air defense network and therefore there was no risk. The S400 would operate independently with reduced performance. As for the F35 program, if Turkey left the program, it would be very delayed and serious financial losses would be incurred. Locheed CEO also mentioned that these things happened in the following years. In addition, a customer who was going to buy at least 130 aircraft left the program. 

Even if Turkey buys a Western-made AD system, it will continue to have S400s until it uses its own systems. We need to mentioned Turkey already lot of times explained it has a serious interest for Samp-T. Because he doesn't trust the West. The so-called Eurasianist soldiers, who are anti-Nato and anti-US, were called schizophrenic, but the realization of what they said now causes Erdoğan and his team to listen to the ideas of Eurasianists. The years 1964, 1974, 1991, 2002, 2010 and July 15, 2016 are the years of changes in Turkey's view of the USA.

The air force actually wanted F35 jets very much, but they too gave up. They are making doctrinal changes. They agree that emphasis should be placed on a large number of domestic jets and modernized F16s, as well as unmanned systems. Since they know some of the secrets of the F35, they know that it is a very good jet and they also have plans to take precautions against the F35 threat. Will Turkey return to the F35 program? I don't know, Turkey no longer has such a demand and will not make concessions. Would Usa want to sell F35 to a S400 user? I don't think so. 

Turkey has been accused many times in the past of modernizing tanks and fighter jets without permission, tampering with the systems, and even trying to break the computer locks of fighter jets. It's hard to know what a legacy manufacturer of the F35 could do to the F35s.

hmmokby

Turns our yes regardless of what the other morons said, given the recent footage of an entire S400 system being BLOWN UP by a 40 year old ATACMS missiles.


Yeah turns out the S400 is dogshit against missiles.

There is a video of Storm Shadow flying over the S400 launcher in Crimea (which was active).

downoakleaf

Russia has committed to delivering the remaining S-400 missile systems to India by 2026, completing a significant defense deal. The system enhances India's air defense capabilities and has strategic importance in regional security, demonstrated during recent tensions.

India's Acquisition of S-400 Missile Systems from Russia

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